Reflections on 4 years at the helm of Manila Water, with Jocot de Dios, CEO, Manila Water

[00:00:00] Piers Clark: Welcome to the Exec Exchange 15 minute podcast, in which a leader from the water sector shares a story to inspire, inform, and educate other water sector leaders from around the globe.
[00:00:10] Piers Clark: My name is Piers Clark and my guest today is Jocot de Dios, Chief Executive at Manila Water. Now, we've had Jocot on the podcast previously. He was actually on Episode 10. We're recording this actually in mid-December because at the end of December, Jocot is moving on from Manila Water and going out of the water sector back into oil and gas and power. And we'll hear a little bit more about that in a minute. And what I wanted to do on this podcast was to reflect on the four years that he has spent as Chief Exec of Manila Water.
[00:00:43] Piers Clark: Jocot, brilliant to have you with us.
[00:00:45] Jocot de Dios: Thank you, Piers and happy to be here.
[00:00:48] Piers Clark: Anyone who listened to podcast 10 will have known your background. Now, just for the audience who didn't know it, you are a lawyer by training. You did some time in government. You then moved into the infrastructure taking on some really big jobs both in Australia and General Electric, and you came to water four years ago, straight into the role of Chief Exec at Manila Water.
[00:01:08] Piers Clark: Now, what I'd love to know is what is your management style?
[00:01:16] Jocot de Dios: Two things come to mind. The very first thing is I go down deep to a fault sometimes. I don't lead from the back. I'm not an armchair general. I go in the field. And I, to a certain extent, I micromanage. It's not necessarily all good, right?
[00:01:32] Jocot de Dios: But it allowed me to understand the sector as quickly as possible, the nuances of the customers, the regulators, operations. And I had very regular meetings with operations, project teams, business development, sales. That's the first.
[00:01:50] Jocot de Dios: I guess the second thing is tough love. I really want to lift people, make them better versions of themselves, but I'll do it, you know, I'll push them really hard to get it done.
[00:02:01] Jocot de Dios: Everybody has a say but not everybody necessarily has his way.
[00:02:06] Piers Clark: So does that mean that you sometimes consciously go, okay, I know I'm micromanaging, but in this situation, dammit, I'm going to micromanage because this is what's needed. Is that how it works?
[00:02:16] Jocot de Dios: For sure, because the troops have to understand that if nobody is willing to do it or think about it or process it, and take the extra steps to deliberate, I'm willing to do it.
[00:02:28] Jocot de Dios: And somehow that sends a signal and short of embarrassing them, you say, this guy is, he's paid to do bigger, broader things, but he's taking time to do the work that I'm supposed to do. So, that's really what we need to instill.
[00:02:43] Piers Clark: Excellent. Alright. Now, we've done a few interviews in the past where we talk to people at the end of their sort of 40 years in the water sector and they tell a much longer story. But the beauty of talking to you today is you came into the water sector four years ago with a very specific vision for Manila Water, and I'm gonna ask you what you wish you'd done differently, which is quite a difficult exam question to answer.
[00:03:05] Piers Clark: But before we get to that, let's start with a happier question of what is it you are most proud of? What are the achievements that you look back on the last four years and think, "Wow, I'm glad I did that."
[00:03:15] Jocot de Dios: Maybe three things. The first thing is pretty much for the sector, broad strokes. I'd like to think that we brought the water narrative to a higher level. I've noticed, certainly in the Philippines, in many economies that water is an underappreciated, undervalued resource. Power hugs the headlines a lot more often than not. Water is really sometimes an afterthought. And so, I think we were able to elevate the narrative about how important it is because we're in Metro Manila, the rest of the Philippines lacks reliable water and wastewater treatment. That's the first.
[00:03:55] Jocot de Dios: The second to the company, I think in the four years we've achieved the highest revenue clocked, highest net income, highest EBITDA margins, highest share price. Our NRWs average 13.57% last year. We've made some growth initiatives. We just recently announced our Mexico activity there. Really that's for the company and comes with it, elevating the quality of the people even more.
[00:04:23] Jocot de Dios: And I guess the third one for me is sustainability. We've committed to our ambitious ESG targets aligned to SDG 6. Every single ESG rating versus 2021 went up. In fact, we're the only company in the Philippines which got an "A CDP" for water. That's huge. I think that speaks volumes about the business we're in and the mission that we've set ourselves to fulfill. So, those are the things I'm happiest and most proud about.
[00:04:51] Piers Clark: Okay. Well, there's a yin and a yang here. If those are the things you're most proud about, which are the ones that you think, oh, I wish we'd been able to do that, or I wish with hindsight I'd done something differently.
[00:05:01] Jocot de Dios: It's just me because I'm gonna have somebody who's gonna take over who's been with the company four years a little longer than me. Very capable.
[00:05:10] Jocot de Dios: But I guess my regrets, maybe number one is there's change management and transformation. I never barged in a new culture. I try to understand, I try to learn and softly weave into it and try to navigate through it. I wish I did it faster. That's the first.
[00:05:27] Piers Clark: I've never met a chief executive. Well, you know what? We went too fast. There's always that urgency that comes through. But there is a rate of course, at which you can do cultural change that if you go far too fast, you might break it.
[00:05:39] Jocot de Dios: Obviously hindsight is 2020. I thought we did it properly, but there's certain pockets that I think to myself, I say I wish I pushed that harder, faster. Not all of it, but some critical aspects of it.
[00:05:53] Jocot de Dios: The second is this concept of my public mission in the private sector stays with me to this day. When I joined government, I didn't have to, at the very young age of 36, I was one of the youngest deputy, if not the youngest deputy ministers under secretaries of the Department of Energy, and that stays with me. Metro Manila, both the east and the west, with our friendly neighbors, Manilad, we are very spoiled. Our water supply is very good.
[00:06:19] Jocot de Dios: The country now faces several issues outside of that because water infrastructure is severely wanting. Obviously, we have presence in multiple sites outside of Metro Manila and we were trying very hard to lock in and provide bulk water services. And we did. We did the smattering of that and also to try to improve distribution, NRW.
[00:06:43] Jocot de Dios: There are, as we speak, projects that are still pending and I wish I spent more time in the growth areas outside of the East Zone.
[00:06:51] Piers Clark: And actually, just for the audience who aren't familiar, Manila, obviously an enormous global city, essentially divided into two halves with Manila Water serving one half, Maynilad Water serving the other. And then you also provide water to some of the, what do we call them, councils in the surrounding region?
[00:07:08] Jocot de Dios: We have local water districts or local municipal water entities. And the water sector in the Philippines they're complicated structures, regulatory frameworks, the different players, but the dominant would be the water districts and joint venture partners.
[00:07:22] Jocot de Dios: We are, for example, in the province in the south, one of the more populous provinces, Laguna. If you take Manila Water and Maynilad, Laguna Water would be the third largest water utility, but it services about 130, 150 million liters per day peak. In Manila Water, we're about 1,600 million liters per day peak.
[00:07:41] Piers Clark: That's about 7 million people that you serve, is that right?
[00:07:45] Jocot de Dios: 7.8. We handle about 28% of Laguna, so maybe roughly at about a million.
[00:07:51] Piers Clark: And I just wanna make sure, 'cause I feel like I let you off the hook there 'cause I diverted this to talking about the structure of Manila. So you're talking about the things you want to do, we wish you'd done with hindsight. One was cultural change, having gone a bit far harder, faster made sure that all the pockets of the organization were coming with you.
[00:08:08] Piers Clark: And the second one was there's always things, as you say in your back garden that you maybe could have put a bit more focus on. That will always be the case, of course, 'cause the thing about the water sector is it's assets are constantly changing and evolving and breaking and needing attention.
[00:08:23] Piers Clark: Any other things in hindsight you wish you'd done?
[00:08:25] Jocot de Dios: Me personally, I wish I spent more time walking the floor, going out on the field. That's more in terms of the people. We have 2,500 employees. And I couldn't visit them enough and really just understand what kept them going? What was moving?
[00:08:42] Jocot de Dios: I can't say enough about, the employees and actually visiting the sites, the macro stuff like the rest of the Philippines' growth. We did a few things. Not enough, it's never enough. But I think the third is, I wish I had spent more time with everyone.
[00:08:57] Piers Clark: You are setting yourself an impossible challenge. Alright, thank you for that. Thank you for that reflection.
[00:09:01] Piers Clark: Now, as I said at the beginning, you came into the water sector four years ago having done a lot of big roles in infrastructure and in government. Now you are moving out of the water sector and I'd love to know, what are your hopes and fears for the water sector internationally and the water sector locally for you?
[00:09:20] Piers Clark: What are the things that you think your successor is going to have to really focus on?
[00:09:25] Jocot de Dios: The global, I think it's the same thing. The narrative has to be elevated even more. What you do, what people globally do in terms of trying to get these views out helps especially with climate change. My gosh, you have droughts in all sorts of places. We need to really elevate that.
[00:09:46] Jocot de Dios: And you know what? To me if you have private sector, there are a lot of funds that invest in water companies, but we need to have a lot of operating utilities cross pollinate in areas where expertise, financial muscle can be put to best use.
[00:10:02] Jocot de Dios: There are not very many transactions that you find. And unlike the power sector globally, people talk about gas, talk about, you know, renewables very regularly.
[00:10:12] Piers Clark: Water gets forgotten.
[00:10:13] Jocot de Dios: For sure. Now, for the Philippines, it's no different. There are few controversies or lingering issues now facing the water sector with respect to certain players. And I won't get into specifics, but it just underscores the need to pay attention to this even more.
[00:10:31] Jocot de Dios: Now I talk about water. I'm not even talking about wastewater and flood water. We are victims of massive floods and how you can integrate that.
[00:10:41] Jocot de Dios: People might think, you know, we pay lip service to ESG and sustainability. Hey guys. No, it can make sense financially as well. I just inaugurated 3.5, I think, megawatt peak more of solar inside the fence. We have about 6.5 megawatt peak of solar inside the fence. And that's only about maybe 4% of our power demand, right? But if we can grow it 2, 5, 10 x, then it'll work. So to me, there's a lot of challenges to make the water work in the Philippines similar to what it is in the global setting, but there has to be a lot of financial activity to bring it up.
[00:11:18] Piers Clark: It's been wonderful knowing you for the last four years, and I wish you the absolute best with your future career. I do find it incredible, you are stopping on December the 30th and starting on January the first. You need a break somewhere there.
[00:11:31] Jocot de Dios: I will break for New Year's Day.
[00:11:34] Piers Clark: Well, its been wonderful talking to you. Now, my last question is if you were a graduate, you're 22 and you just starting in the water sector, what advice would you give them?
[00:11:45] Jocot de Dios: Try to get as much, I guess, experience as possible. We have cadets that we get out of college, and pretty much what they do is they stay their whole lives in the company. I mean, maybe a good part, first five, 10 years of their lives. If I were to change that, I'd tell them learn as quickly as you can, as many disciplines as you can, move across different companies so that you gain experience because if you stay within, you're not able to see what the world has to offer. Go bigger than water itself. Go to the adjacencies. Try to look at other disciplines and don't be stuck in the pure engineering or the technical operations.
[00:12:27] Jocot de Dios: Get as much focus as you can because at the end, your skillset may be applicable globally as well. And then eventually you can come back to your mother country and run a public agency where you can solve the country's water woes or water problems.
[00:12:43] Piers Clark: You have been listening to the Exec Exchange with me, Piers Clark and my guest today reflecting on four years at the helm of Manila Water, has been Jocot de Dios, Chief Executive at Manila Water.
[00:12:57] Piers Clark: I hope you can join us next time. Thank you.